Kait’s Mistakes
Posted by Gail | Filed under Debt Traps
Have y’all noticed the “Polls” on the front page of the blog? (Scroll down) Each week there’s a new poll and over time I’ll be telling you the results. Check on Mondays to see the question of the week and vote. You can only vote once and then you’ll see the results.
The world seems to broken down into people who can see what’s going to happen next and those who can’t. Take my friend Kaitlin. Kait barrels through life hitting and missing. She can’t see how spending money on her credit card this month means she won’t have the money next month to pay her car insurance. She can’t see how taking a vacation now means less income next month when she has less work to invoice for. And she is always puzzled at how she can make a good living and never have any money.
Kait makes some basic mistakes that lots of other people make. When Kait sees something she likes, she buys it. She never shops around or price-checks. Hey, it might be gone if she doesn’t snap it up right now. So out comes her credit card. While there are folks who take the price-comparison thing to a whole other extreme, this never happens to my Kait. She’s ready to shell out for the latest and greatest and is willing to drop a bundle because she “needs” a designer label.
Another mistake Kait makes is never thinking about the total cost of ownership associated with some purchases. Sure, that nifty digital camera was a good deal, and the free printer make it an absolute steal, but the ink she’ll need to print her pictures never enters her mind. This applies to all sorts of things from cars to boats to hot-tubs and swimming pools; often the cost of upkeep is never worked into the budget and becomes a strain on cash flow.
Since Kait is a have-it-now kinda girl, she’s all about finding ways to have more stuff with the lowest possible impact on her cash flow. That means she’s a rent-to-own and lease for the long-term chick – anything that will get her what she wants now for the lowest possible payment. What Kaitlin refuses to do is calculate the true cost of what she’s acquiring. And since most of the things Kait acquires fall into the “depreciating assets” category – in other words, they lose value, they don’t grow wealth – this bad habit results in a constant drain on her pocketbook.
Kait also tends to be a bit lackadaisical about her payments. She was surprised recently when she found out that her late cell phone payments were being recorded on her credit history, and that’s what had driven up the interest rate on her line of credit. “I didn’t even know cell phone companies reported to the credit bureau,” she said as she huffed and puffed.
“Most of them don’t” I said. “Yours does. Why were you late anyway?”
“I just keep forgetting,” she whined. Lord love a duck.
Kait lives with the Impulse Monkey on her back. Shop with a list? You must be joking. She never knows what she’ll end up buying. Off she goes to the supermarket to wonder the aisles. “That’s how I get inspired to cook,” she says, “and you always tell me to stop eating out.”
I admit it, I do go on about how much cheaper it is to cook at home. But not the way Kait does it. She over-cooks, using expensive ingredients and wasting tons of stuff. I shudder when I see her experimenting with jumbo shrimp and then tossing them into the garbage because “they don’t really taste very good.” Kait is particularly good at tricking herself into thinking she got a “good deal”. She’ll stock up on something that’s on sale and then end up throwing it out a year later because she never used it. I’ve watched her pour bottles of dressing and expensive sauces down the sink (yes, she recycles) because they’ve expired.
But the habit Kait has that most drives me crazy is her penchant for bouncing cheques. She’s done it to me twice (but never again, now I only take cash). She’ll go a month or two with everything in sync and then she’ll bounce a bunch of cheques racking up astronomical banking fees. She bitches about the fees. “It’s rapacious what they charge,” she complains. Are you kidding me? Who told you to write a cheque you couldn’t cover?
There’s no saving Kait. I’ve tried. It’s an exercise in frustration. But I also won’t listen to her whine about how crappy her life is, how much debt she’s in, or how hard it is to make ends meet. The last time she headed off on a vacation she couldn’t afford to pay for I told her plain and simple, “Girl, I love you, but you’re a moron. Don’t come bitchin’ to me when this bill comes it.” She hasn’t.
December 3, 2009 at 10:04 am
Hey as long as I am not asked to pay for it I could care less what she does.
December 3, 2009 at 10:13 am
I work with someone like this, always complaining to me about his monthly expenses for a wife, three kids at home, a teenage daughter, her boyfriend and baby (who sometimes move back home). Then the wife gets the second tattoo session that only cost $400 (her whole leg, kids names and roses). Or, the big screen TV that ‘we didn’t need, but it’s only $40/month”, or “I wanna buy a camcorder, so we can film the wildlife when I take my son hunting for his first time. I’ll put it on my credit card, and pay it back when I get my Income Tax refund”. Really? It’s October, Income Tax time is how many months away? Then they buy ANOTHER Shi-tzu puppy for $350 to keep the other one company, but the kids step in the crap on the floor rather than clean up after these animals. How do you politely say “I don’t want to hear about your stupidity?” The best part was when they were out for a drive, and test drove a club cab half ton truck, and next thing you know, they traded in the minivan. Didn’t need it, but Hey, it’s nicer…. I think this person has a sign on his back, or micro chip that beeps when he walks in the door, and salespeople come running to make their commission. I have tried to talk to him, set up numbers on paper, and see just what he is doing to himself, but to no avail. He recently put a new furnace on his credit card! When the wall comes crashing down, I hope I can muster up some sympathy for him and his family, but it’s not likely. I also have a sister who saves herself into poverty. Every visit has her pulling stuff out of closets to show me how little she paid, how much she saved, etc. But it’s in your closet, I want to tell her, or “do you really need that, regardless of what she saved?” How do you get through to these people Gail? I want all my family and friends to be Gail-ized, but it’s a tough haul. I guess that when they finally clue in to what I am doing with what I have, the lesson might rub off… Who knows? Gail, you are a Godsend to those of us who DO listen, please don’t ever stop what you do. Thank you, thank you, thank you.
December 3, 2009 at 10:18 am
I am sure we all have a friend like this or we are or have been this person.
My friend continually lives in overdraft. I think she shops partially for something to do. She doesn’t need new towels (or whatever) She just is bored with the ones she has so changes them.
She says she wants to be out of debt but only as long as a little fairy comes down adn waves a magic wand to take away all the debt. She doesn’t want to work or scrimp to get rid of it.
Getting out of debt is hard work.
December 3, 2009 at 10:21 am
I, too, have a friend who’s complete lack of discipline regarding finances makes me coo coo.
Renovations are completed, new furniture, clothing, dinners out….are all accomplished sans adequate income. It is very hard to be excited for her next event/purchase when I know at what cost.
I worry and fret about her ” budget”.
It drives my husband crazy that I am worried about her. So now I just smile and try to be happy for her and the fact that her need for “stuff” has been fulfilled.
I will look at my envelopes of money and “mind my own business” (my husband’s advice)., thankful it isn’t me.
I hope the inevitable disaster I feel is looming doesn’t arrive before she sees the error of her ways.
December 3, 2009 at 10:24 am
I think we all know someone like Kait. it always amazes me that the complaints are for easily fixable things, but they just don’t want to put the work in to correct the situation.
Alas, we can’t fix everyone!
Great post, ad reminder of how easy it is to slip back into old money habits and be off on a grand life that costs 28.9% interest!!
December 3, 2009 at 10:30 am
I have an uncle like this…he spent 30 grand (on credit) on a single horse race because he would have won a million bucks if the horse won. Now he’s got that and whatever other debt to pay off, but there’s still money to eat out every night and vacation somewhere tropical a couple of times a year. I’m not worried about him seeing this post because the computer he got 2 years ago (free when he signed up for 2 years of high speed) is still in the box. That’s right, he’s been paying monthly for internet and hasn’t “had time” to set up the computer yet!
December 3, 2009 at 10:31 am
It’s mind-boggling that someone could be friends wtih Gail, the debt-free queen, and still think it’s a good idea to whine about poor money habits! People are amazing creatures.
The take-home mesage I got from this post was that even if people are doing things you don’t agree with/approve of, you can still be a friend, but you must set some boundaries to save your sanity (e.g., not accepting cheques, not listening to the whining about money).
December 3, 2009 at 10:40 am
It’s hard to watch someone you care about make mistakes, especially when you have the skills and knowledge to help them. Unfortunately, the bottom line is that you cannot help someone who doesn’t want to be helped. Still, that doesn’t make it any easier to watch.
December 3, 2009 at 10:45 am
I thought I was reading about my husband! He too, is a live for today, impulse buyer….always the latest & greatest. I joke that they could sell him a dead horse…if it was the latest model of dead horse and the last one in stock. Thankfully, he is aware of his inability to manage money and has handed the reins to me…a stubborn and stingy Scot. The credit cards are locked up, he has money in the bank and the bills are paid on time. That said, it does get tiring…being the ‘money police’ at times.
December 3, 2009 at 10:46 am
Yup, I’ve got a friend like that too. It used to drive me nuts how she would whine that she couldn’t “afford” something and then she’d charge up impulse purchases on high interest credit cards. For some people money is “easy come easy go”. I’ve learned not to stress about it. Somehow she manages to stay afloat and if she’s lucky she’ll always manage. She’ll inherit her father’s house (which she lives in right now) and she got a job with an employer who has a pension plan, so I’m confident she’ll be okay in spite of it all. Let’s just love them and stay out of their business. If they don’t ask us for advice, it’s best not to offer.
December 3, 2009 at 10:48 am
Funny… unless you have a “bird’s eye view” into some people’s finances, you don’t always know that the money they use to buy stuff is not really money they have… even though you might suspect it. Case in point – I have a friend who gets her nails done and visits fancy hair salons regularly, goes out for lunch with friends several times a week and always has nice new clothes, shoes and handbags. She has been out of work for at least 2 years now. Her EI ran out about a year ago. Her husband, who is the sole financial supporter in this family of 5 has an unstable income due to part time work. To talk to the wife, money isn’t a problem and all is fine in that department. I’ve often thought to myself “What the heck am I doing wrong???”. Now, I had the pleasure of sitting down and chatting with her husband the other day and I got quite a different picture of their financial life. He told me that the plan had been that once the mortgage was paid off (5 years ago), that money would get redirected to their LOC. Instead, that extra money just evaporates here and there, and the credit line that should have been paid off years ago, is still growing. Despite being in their mid 40’s, they have virtually no money saved in RRSP’s and essentially live in their credit line month to month. He seemed discouraged and hopeless about the situation. I told him that things needed to change quite significantly to turn it around but that it was very much possible. I told him what we were doing and how successful it was. He just said “talk to my wife!”. I feel badly for him (and them as a unit). I hope they see the light some day. I’m SOOO glad I did!!!
December 3, 2009 at 11:18 am
I too have a friend like Gail’s…this girl went out and bought a chandelier when she didn’t have a couch to sit on! I remember going over and we all sat on kitchen chairs and admired the chandelier. I have made up the shortfall for weekends away and lunches and dinners but to tell the truth I resented it. So no more…she has to feel the pain if she is ever going to change which I sincerely believe will not happen. I have limited my contact with her because I am so frustrated dealing with her.
December 3, 2009 at 11:19 am
I once had someone tell me that they don’t keep track of their chequing account…they just couldnt be bothered with the work…that’s how she lost 3 homes…really???…you lose the 1st home and don’t learn a lesson??….then 2 more really don’t matter…what a scary way to live….plus having your head in the sand like that must be really suffocating!
December 3, 2009 at 11:44 am
I agree that we all have friends or family members like this, and that we do need to put up boundaries to stay sane. You can lead a horse to water…
I have come to the conclusion that about all we can do is be examples in the world and folks who are wanting to make changes will seek us out and ask how we do it. But this can take a while, as those of us living a la Gail aren’t terribly flash, are we? But I’ve seen it in my own extended family as people age: the not-so-flash-when-younger folks now have the time and space to travel extensively, to help their children with university, to build that backyard gazebo they’ve always wanted, to walk away from work when they’re ready (or towards work they find more fulfilling). Some of the flash-when-younger folks have had to sell homes and downsize/rent (HAD TO not CHOSE TO), work in jobs they constantly complain about, and don’t have the money to travel, not even to see their grandkids. Lesson learned. If you can’t serve a good example, you’ll just have to serve as a terrible warning!
December 3, 2009 at 12:03 pm
To Suzanne:
“who saves herself into poverty”
To me this is a unique type of a person that is living in a false financial world.
I know alot of these people and you cannot explain to them that buying 2 jugs of mayo at Costco could actually cause you to LOSE money in the long-term (let alone the inconvenience of the darn thing in the fridge). Or buying holiday items like xmas cards after the holidays (a good idea) yet forgetting about them come the next year & rushing to buy xmas cards for a premium.
I would love to hear Gail’s comments on this type of a person.
December 3, 2009 at 12:46 pm
I work hard so I deserve it. You can’t take it with you. Live for today. He spends on what he wants so I am just getting what I want. I’m not here for a long time so I’m going to make sure it is a good time. You never know when you will get hit by a bus. My estate will pay my bills. I don’t intend to be 80 years old and regret all the things I didn’t buy or do. What’s the point of saving, we have government pensions/healthcare.
These are all things that my Sister has said to me. She is definitely a Kait. Now I am no angel but compared to her I am a model of responsibility and restraint. I have done everything that Kait and my Sister has done- but only once. Or twice. I do learn my lessons and late in life we have finally smartened up and are living debt free (were forced to in the beginning but came to love it).
There is no saving my Sister. At least not much that I can do. She has to want to do it and she doesn’t. She lived a very “carefree” life believing that nothing would change or could touch her. Right now everything is changing and she is getting slammed. All the years of fun that still have to be paid for are hanging over her (and her husband) and they are teetering on the edge of total financial collapse.
The Hubster and I went through this and they saw what happened to us. We were lucky and scared enough to move fast enough to save ourselves. It would have been great if they had learned from our mistakes and made changes but I guess that they never thought it could happen to them. Actually that should read they never thought it could happen to them again. Of course they didn’t know because they never, ever did the math. I honestly don’t know what the future holds (sleepless nights for all of us so far) but I do know that the Bank of Mom and Pop is gone and the Bank of Sis and Bro is a micro-finance institution. I have offered advice and tried to get her to watch Til Debt but you can lead a horse to Gail but you cannot make her think.
December 3, 2009 at 2:15 pm
I have a friend who is not like Kait but her boyfriend is. He actually scolded her lack of spending one day saying “your friend so-and-so who works with you and makes the same wage is out buying anything she likes and going on trips, how come you won’t?”. She had to explain that so-and-so comes from a financially healthy family and does not have a student loan, or a car payment and therefore has a larger disposable income. It makes you wonder how some people can believe money grows on trees.
I agree that watching someone you care about make these money mistakes is infuriating but I have also found that by being money-savy myself I have actually inspired a few people to make some small changes. The use of the word “budget” has popped up a few times in conversations where it never appeared before.
December 3, 2009 at 2:57 pm
hey – I have those duck pjs in the picture
But my closet sure doesn’t look like that!
December 3, 2009 at 4:58 pm
I’d very much like to know how to word a tactful yet effective “don’t complain to me anymore” speech. It would be useful in a couple of different circumstances…
December 3, 2009 at 5:29 pm
@AnnieA
When it starts getting repetitive, I get repetitive back. Same complaint gets the same response. Eventually they get bored.
December 3, 2009 at 5:40 pm
It’s so hard for me to remember sometimes that people who buy “everything they want” have bills, sacrifices, and problems that I don’t necessarily see.
I have worked and sacrificed very hard over the last three years to get out of debt and although not being able to afford lunch out with my coworkers is humbling to admit, it’s not nearly as stressful as trying to figure out how to pay my bills because I blew my budget on fast food.
(Funny how it’s the same story with people who “eat what they want” and SEEM to get away with it. I’m learning that consistancy is a big key)
December 3, 2009 at 5:47 pm
People like this make me feel better about myself.
Everyone has a “Kait” in their life. Instead of “Kait”, I usually call my “L + Dirtbag”. I never liked Dirtbag (husband’s friend). When L came into the picture and they got married, I felt sorry for L, as Dirtbag brought in a crapload of debt.
I stopped feeling sorry when L changed her outlook on money to adapt to Dirtbag. Together, they have over $85000 in consumer and school debt. After talking with L, she realized poop had hit the fan when she found out Dirtbag rarely paid any bills aside from rent and utilities! She was oblivious to her money situation!
L started using Gail’s jars… however, after a month or two, she started giving Dirtbag more “entertainment money” because of his smoking habit, and coffee habit, and computer game habit…. oi.
Again, while talking with L, I asked how things were going… we talked about how to juggle the debt and get lower interest rates (they can’t). Interesting enough, Dirtbag is getting vacation pay out in December – instead of paying down debt, they bought camera equipment (some of which was items to replace previous equipment that Dirtbag happened to lose). They also bought Dirtbag Lasik eye surgery, and recently took a week of work each to go down to Cuba.
Ugh.
People like this make me feel better about myself.
Hubby and I only ahve $2800 left of student loan – I’ve almost paid it off in 2.5 years (started out at $25000). It’s been great, as we’ve lived cheaply, got married in the process, and are only supply teachers with unknown income each month!
December 3, 2009 at 8:35 pm
I know a couple like Kait. They somehow had money for flashy new rims for their car, for a hefty boozing habit, but they’ve got a maxed out student line of credit and 2 credit cards (all while living rent-free with mom and dad!)
It did make my guy and I feel bad for a while… they had so many nice things, and we’re scrimping away! However, now that our emergency fund is up to 2 months of expenses, we were able to take a great vacation opportunity! Good things come to those who wait…
December 3, 2009 at 9:13 pm
Yes we all know people like this…I have two…one is a friend of a relative and one was a co-worker.
Both continually complain/complained about no money and oh whoa is me and why can’t I ever get ahead and why don’t we have anything…blah blah blah…in the next breath it’s oh we bought a new snowmobile, we have a new car, we are LEASING a holiday trailer because we can afford the payments. I’m not sure if I can buy groceries next pay day…OMG I cannot believe this. I just listen and say oh really, did you know that there is this great show I watch called Till Debt do Us Part??? You should watch it…the answer…I can’t right now because the cable got cut off because I didn’t pay the bill, but I will have enough to pay the bill after I go to bingo on the weekend (what???) and then I could maybe check the show out?
Like many have said, you can’t fix stupid.
December 3, 2009 at 9:32 pm
My! Aren’t we all judgemental! I’m sure we all have things about us that drive someone crazy. Just worry about your own situation, offer advice if asked, and otherwise keep your mouth shut. Nagging never caused anyone to do anything.
December 3, 2009 at 9:56 pm
Sometimes there are reasons that people make quick, rash decisions. I have worked with a number of adults who have been diagnosed with Attention Deficit Disorder and these would be some of the indicators of an underlying condition. Perhaps there is more to this than poor decision making skills.
December 3, 2009 at 10:06 pm
“Just worry about your own situation, offer advice if asked, and otherwise keep your mouth shut.”
Easy to say but like AnnieA mentioned, it is very annoying to hear the same complaints over and over and over again. It mightnotbe the most polite thing to say but I have used the “Can I do anything about your problem? No? Then I don’t want to hear about it!” and the “Every time you complain about X to me, you owe me a penny.” I did not deserve as many pennies as I had hoped.
December 3, 2009 at 10:09 pm
Lisa,
I don’t think anyone was purposely being judgemental. I think that we all know people like Gail’s friend and it frustrates us to no end when we offer the help asked for and they still don’t get it or they continue to complain that it’s not working.
December 3, 2009 at 10:35 pm
I agree with Pat. I think there are lots of reasons people don’t want to face reality. In some cases, it could be their way of dealing with the overwhelming amount of stress in their lives, just like any other addiction. In our case, we had two very significant deaths which led me to believe I would probably die young too so I should go out and make hay while the sun shone. Although, we never had unmanageable debt and luckily, no major expenses over a 20 year period of time, I still think of the waste and the money we could have saved. As for those who don’t seem to care about their finances, I would say that as long as they don’t take you down with them, let them make their mistakes.
December 3, 2009 at 11:15 pm
I’m fortunate that I haven’t had this problem with my friends and relatives. However, I did have a co-worker who continually made bad choices re: finances and men and would come to work with her tales of woe. When we’d try to warn off certain losers or give her advice she’d simply ignore it. Finally we all got fed up and simply told her “you don’t listen to good advice” so you won’t get any more sympathy from us. We don’t want to hear about it.” It was harsh but we were all getting worn down by her continual ongoing drama.
Sometimes I wonder if it’s also that some people thrive on living on the edge of disaster and it gives them some kind of high or they like the drama and the attention?
December 4, 2009 at 1:15 am
@ Rita: I think you have very accurately described some people – the drama addicts. I have worked with people like this and have acquaintances and family members who thrive on the razor’s edge.
One thing that I have noticed about these people is that the the world revolves around them. They want you to listen endlessly to their problems but have absolutely no interest in your life. Personally I live by the live and let live philosophy and don’t much care what anyone else does as long as they “don’t do it in the street and frighten the horses”. I am quite private so hate when others enter into my life uninvited and get squirmy when others share too much. But if you insist on inviting me into your life you should be warned that I tend to stomp around a bit. You should also expect that if you tell the world all your problems and private affairs and yet do nothing to change, keep repeating the same mistakes and then insist on talking about them you are bound to be judged and that judgment probably won’t be very pretty.. You are also bound to bore the pants off of everyone eventually. I have been “harsh” a few times (and shame on me – I quite enjoyed it) but not to worry. The piss and moaner soon finds someone else to piss and moan to.
My number one rule is to try to avoid getting involved but my husband says I have one of those faces that people like to talk too and my eyes apparently show interest and ooze sympathy even when I am actually just napping with them open. Kind of like a semi-conscious Basset Hound.
I have made every financial mistake it is possible to make so have nothing but understanding for those who are taking the same road. I just hope they get the same wake up call.
Nowadays I take care of my own situation. I worry about friends and family. I warn them when I see them running with scissors. I long ago gave up any idea that they will listen to anything I have to say so I stand by with band aids and hot tea. I listen when they want to talk. I provide help when I can. I offer advice when asked and although I am really good at biting my tongue sometimes some unsolicited advice does come tripping off. I don’t worry about these slips because I long ago gave up any idea that they will listen to anything I have to say. It took most of my life but I now know that you cannot stop anyone from making mistakes or force them to change. I hate to watch as Thelma and Louise gun the motor of their car but know that the cuts and bruises you get from personal experience are worth a thousand words. I just hold my breath and hope they bounce. I never expect anyone to substitute my judgment for their own or to do as I want them to do but I often think that they are complete asses for not doing so. For gosh sakes I am the perfect bad example so they should use me.